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Old 02-08-2005, 04:00 PM   #46
bhanna
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Count me among the "not bothered". In fact, I am SO not bothered I can't believe I'm actually taking the time to say that.
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Old 02-08-2005, 04:56 PM   #47
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You can count me in as well for not being bothered by the links.
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Old 02-08-2005, 09:23 PM   #48
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Same here. I think asking for comments is the way to go, and even if some get mad about a new way of generating a return from a well done job.

I can understand that some people dislike the way contextual ads are used by that technology, but it certainly is not like spyware, it is yet another way for webmasters to monetize their sites.

Specially since this very site offers a no-ads version (which I'm not buying anytime soon cuz I'm too lazy to type my CC's 12 digit code and love to see ads )
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Old 02-08-2005, 10:39 PM   #49
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The name calling stuff in this thread is, for me, far more serious than the initial issue of the links.

Frankly, if the name calling is the best attempt some can do to discuss issues, then I have better things to do than read, or reply further to this discussion, or, for that matter, any discussion on any board, geek or otherwise.

If you want to talk about damaged reputations, what's worse? Having a few words in a message in color, or having namecalling become the coin of the realm.

There are lots of places, which we used to call "kiddie boards" where insults and namecalling are the way to communicate. If that's going to happen here, I'll simply get my information from more trusted sources, since I don't consider people who's best contributions are "what a scumbag" to be useful, interesting or trustworthy.
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Old 02-09-2005, 01:52 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally posted by rbacal
The name calling stuff in this thread is, for me, far more serious than the initial issue of the links.

Frankly, if the name calling is the best attempt some can do to discuss issues, then I have better things to do than read, or reply further to this discussion, or, for that matter, any discussion on any board, geek or otherwise.

If you want to talk about damaged reputations, what's worse? Having a few words in a message in color, or having namecalling become the coin of the realm.

There are lots of places, which we used to call "kiddie boards" where insults and namecalling are the way to communicate. If that's going to happen here, I'll simply get my information from more trusted sources, since I don't consider people who's best contributions are "what a scumbag" to be useful, interesting or trustworthy.
A valid concern and I actually agree with everything you have said GEEK rbacal

From where I site I'm darn sure we won't see the implosion of GV and I'm very confident that Czar/Josh will take action to insure that we return to quality and civility. Matter of fact, I will make you this promise, I'm coming out of retirement if thats what it takes If you would like to chat further via phone, please shoot me a PM and I would be happy to call you.

Actually the destruction of Communities happens all the time. Iv'e seen them destroyed by a few in less than 2 weeks. Let me please tell you a story that illustrates this point.

Way back in early 2000 I was not spending enough time inside this Community. I was to a certain exstent, a rookie Admin which became even more pronounced as we were in the middle of a huge growth cycle. The making money Forum turned VERY VERY harsh with name calling, insulting questions, merchnats fighting with each other and members fighting with everyone. It was a bloody brawel. In a period of week and I had basically lost control of the Community and worse still, I was not even sure how to fix it. A HUGE mistake made by me.

I was being "tested" as the Admin/Owner and a few folks senced my weekness and began to undermine the civility and eventually the quality of the Community. All new Admins will be tested.

Given my indecision and lack of experience at the time, I closed the Forum. Thats not a typo, I shut the place down and I even had advertisers at the time. I also turned off new registrations to control abuse and started a thread asking for help and advice. NO one could post in the making money Forum but they could still read the posts. A lot of members gave me some really outstanding advice and also told me what I didn't know, just ban them and move on.

Thats what I did and continued to do till the day I sold this site. It's not something I enjoy. It's not even personell. I asked once. Then I told you not to do it and then after that you are toast. For the rest of your naturall life. One year membership or 2 minute membership. Please find another suitable Community. It was very painfull for me, but I learned so much. 14 days later on an unnanounced schedule the Forums opened again with well drafted and conceived Rules. We had over 30 civil and respectfull, posts in the first 30 minutes and as I recall perhaps 6 members were no longer around. A week later I opened up registration on a more controlled basis.

We were fine and have been fine ever since. Running a Community of this ilk with our goals is perhaps the most challenging aspect of life. In the beginning all new Admin/Owners get tested and thats without the slightest doubt part of this very very serious issue.

Is my way the only way. Certainly not. Their are at least 2 ways to do everything since running a Community is an Art and not science.

At the end of the day, I'm not even the judge of the validity of my actions. The marketplace determines that. Are folks still interested in advertising On GV and do new members continue to join. Do very talented and smart Publishers like you and so many others continue to particpate, Do Merchants/Networks Like Bob H of Burst and many many others continue to not onoly read but participate. Is the quality of the posts and never the volume still generally on target. You bet your bippy. Thats the final authoruty.

Please don't leave and lets move forward and hope this thread gets locked real soon.

Best wishes to all

Last edited by Steve_S; 02-09-2005 at 01:54 AM.
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Old 02-09-2005, 02:46 AM   #51
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Steve I posted a message that was on page 2 of this thread. It was the next to last message on that page.

I made nice peaceful comments. While I didn't actually say it, I came close to saying it, and I implied it, and that was I felt it was time to lock this thread even then.

Since you have actually said the words I'll say it as well. I'd like to see this thread locked.

I expessed my opinon on the issue that this thread was about and my reasons, but I won't go into that because there is a bigger issue involved, as Steve has just mentioned.

I do a lot of posting at Geek/Talk and some might think I'm relatively new around here.

I just came out in the open. I was here lurking since 1999 on almost a daily basis. I've read almost every post and I've seen the good and bad that has gone on here.

I know Steve and Czar/Josh a little from private e-mail exchanges I've had with both of them. I know they both stand for basically the same thing.

Before I continue, let me mention that this particular subject was just a hot issue. It was hotter than some could have possibly thought it would have been.

With hot issues things can really get out of hand very quickly because of the strong emotions and different opinions.

Good examples would be religion, politics and abortion. Believe me, I'm not going to say anything about any of those subjects.

In observing Steve as the owner for several years and observing Czar as a posting member and then moderator and finally owner it was very clear that their thoughts were very similar as to how Geek/Talk should be. They both stand for the same thing.

This particular thread just turned out to be the politics, abortion and religion thread of Geek/Talk and some emotions based upon very strong belief got to the boiling point just as it would if it were one of those 3 subjects with people exchanging their thoughts and making their arguments.

Actually this was probably mild compared to how things could have gotten with those subjects.

The good thing is that people were given a chance to express how they felt and just about eveything that needs to be said has been said. But it is good that people had their say. Naturally everyone isn't going to agree.

But if anyone looks at the thousands of postings Czar/Josh has made here it becomes clear that he added a lot to the forums, he has always gone out of his way to help people.

As a moderator and as an owner he has followed the same path as Steve.

Because of the emotions created by this issue some people are starting to have negative thoughts about Geek Village as a whole. Emotions can do that.

This great village can't be measured by this one thread.

Steve started something that is great and sold it to someone he felt would keep it that way. He made the right decision in my opinion.

Josh/Czar wants the great tradition to continue and even make some improvements over time.

It is always best when someone else says nice things about a person rather than a person saying nice things about himself or herself, so I decided to say some nice things about both Steve and Czar.

In the thread in which I introuduced myself in Geek/Yak someone asked why I was a lurker for so long before I joined.

I answered and said it was because I had been in forums previously in which there were a lot of people who weren't very nice and it turned me off when it came to forums so much so that I had decided I was never going to be involved with another forum.

Over the years I did send e-mail answers to some people who posted questions at Geek/Talk and hadn't received answers to their questions but I still didn't join.

I happened to exchange e-mail with Czar a few times over the years related to Geek/Talk and he suggested more than once that I should join. But, I hated forums so much that I didn't want to join.

I saw for myself how things were different at Geek/Talk and Czar also mentioned that to me. Finally he talked me into joining and I became an active member.

I didn't like the way this one particular thread was going. If I didn't know how the real Geek Village was and know that it was going to remain as good as it always was I would have left this forum and never returned to it or any forum in my life because it was starting to remind me of a 3 ring circus.

But, I knew it was just one thread with very strong emotions. The strongest of any thread in recent memory. When the thread either ends on its own or is locked things would return to normal.

After I made my posting near the end of page 2 I really didn't plan to post anything else in this thread because I thought enough had been said and I just would like to see it end. Right now I would like to see Czar quickly lock this thread and throw away the key.

I know I'm not going to judge Czar on this one thred. That wouldn't be fair.

He cares about this community. He knows the history and what it stands for. He knows the respect it has and I know he will do everything possible to maintain that respect.

This thread will eventually end - the sooner the better. We can all look back on it as just a bad dream or possibly a bad nightmare. But, it will become a thing of the past. We can all then look towards the future and after a while we will see that Geek Village is what it has always been - A great place to visit and a great place to be associated with as members.

Last edited by Larwee; 02-09-2005 at 03:54 AM.
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Old 02-09-2005, 05:22 AM   #52
Jan

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Quote:
Originally posted by rbacal
The name calling stuff in this thread is, for me, far more serious than the initial issue of the links.

Frankly, if the name calling is the best attempt some can do to discuss issues, then I have better things to do than read, or reply further to this discussion, or, for that matter, any discussion on any board, geek or otherwise.

If you want to talk about damaged reputations, what's worse? Having a few words in a message in color, or having namecalling become the coin of the realm.

There are lots of places, which we used to call "kiddie boards" where insults and namecalling are the way to communicate. If that's going to happen here, I'll simply get my information from more trusted sources, since I don't consider people who's best contributions are "what a scumbag" to be useful, interesting or trustworthy.
It won't happen here anymore. This was a contoversial issue and tempers did flare somewhat, with genuine grievances. Unfortunately it continued well after the source of the abuse was removed.

But from hereon in, and any future attacks will see this thread closed forever and a few departing our shores. I am truly surprised at some otherwise respected members resorting to such petty digs, not only against the staff but also long time fellow members.

Feel free to continue discussing the concept of this form of advertising, but please keep it civil or the thread will be closed.
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Old 02-09-2005, 05:23 AM   #53
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Threads like this do say a great deal about the community. Despite the hiccups and a few bouts of the type of abusive behaviour that you wouldn't expect to occur in a face-to-face professional meeting, the restraint, diplomacy and strength exhibited by the vast majority of those who contributed to this thread is testament to the quality of members that this forum continues to attract.

Even when discussing an unexpectedly hot-button issue, most members offered constructive and supportive comments. The pettiness associated with a few inappropriate posts was uncharacteristic for this community and, even in the most extreme of cases, the members involved were traditionally productive and helpful members.

As with any community, there will be conflicts of personality and conviction in discussions every now and then. While exchanges were inflamed above a comfortable level in this thread for a brief stint, this is no way should be construed as the direction that I - or the wonderful community that is YOU - have worked towards taking this forum.

While we chose not to go crazy with the ban button in relation to this thread, Geek/Talk's support of open and honest discourse hasn't extended to allow abuse or flames. As such, at least one member received an official warning as a result of comments made here and others were continually reminded that Team Geek is determined to protect its members against abuse - whether the members facing such attacks are moderators, newbies or experienced senior GEEKS like most of you.

This community has never been about myself or about Steve. We just keep things ticking over and invest time and effort into fostering an environment supportive of rewarding exchanges of relationship-building information, advice and encouragement. It is all of YOU who are the heart of Geek/Talk and the fact that this BB has continued to grow and thrive for almost seven solid years is evidence that the occasional outburst of inappropriate behaviour is barely a blip on the radar when compared to the masses of useful data that is exchanged here on a daily basis.

I will lock this thread since it has run its course. Nevertheless, I invite members to start related threads if they wish to discuss IntelliTXT, forum administration advice, contextual advertising developments or related concepts in greater depth and in a context devoid of slander.

I know I've rambled on a bit, but it needed to be said that this community and its membership are too strong to be judged based on the uncharacteristic actions of a few. The quality exchanges that we witness here every day gives Team Geek the motivation to continue tirelessly promoting, developing and protecting this community. With your support, I have no doubt that Geek/Talk will continue to grow and improve, without compromising the exceptional standards that this forum has come to represent.

Thank you all for your wonderful contributions.

<locked>
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Last edited by Czar; 02-09-2005 at 05:24 AM.
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