Webmaster Forum Rules | Posting Guide | Contact Us | Testimonials | Contributing Geek Program | Advertise on Geek/Talk
Welcome to the GeekTalk Webmaster Discussion Forums from GeekVillage.com

Click Here To Register. It's Free!

Go Back   geek/talk: Web publishing business discussion > YOUR REVENUE: Making Money On The Internet > Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 12-04-2001, 04:14 PM   #1
JP Sauve
Member.
 
JP Sauve's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Ottawa, Ontario
Posts: 757
Default no wonder CPM is dead

No wonder CPM is dead. I've tried several pre-paid advertising
opportunities and except in a few occasions I've found the traffic
seller lied about either quoted "average" results, traffic quality,
traffic quantity, the size of their mailing list, etc.

I've found this problem is now bleeding over to pre-paid CPA
deals. How frustrating! Basically anything is said to get one
to pay in advance with promises of good results that never
materialize. Is the industry in such bad shape that those tactics
are really necessary?

It's a shame that an unfortunately GROWING minority of crooked
webmasters are turning me off what could very well be beneficial
relationships with others that are good.
JP Sauve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2001, 04:29 PM   #2
darnell
Registered User
 
darnell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Suwanee, GA, USA
Posts: 704
Default

CPM is "almost" dead simply because it's an advertiser's market.

Shady tactics is pretty messed up, but it's part of this business. It won't be going away any time soon.
darnell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2001, 09:21 PM   #3
Lil_Red
Registered User
 
Lil_Red's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Posts: 1,579
Default Re: no wonder CPM is dead

Quote:
Originally posted by suave
No wonder CPM is dead. I've tried several pre-paid advertising
opportunities and except in a few occasions I've found the traffic
seller lied about either quoted "average" results, traffic quality,
traffic quantity, the size of their mailing list, etc.

I've found this problem is now bleeding over to pre-paid CPA
deals. How frustrating! Basically anything is said to get one
to pay in advance with promises of good results that never
materialize. Is the industry in such bad shape that those tactics
are really necessary?

It's a shame that an unfortunately GROWING minority of crooked
webmasters are turning me off what could very well be beneficial
relationships with others that are good.
Funny that you mention crooked webmasters, I've come across quite a few crooked ad networks. I had one ad network tell me in August, they had sold 100% of our inventory through the end of the year. Guess what - they lied.

It's the nature of the business world, salesmen do whatever it takes to close a deal. I used to work for a company where the salesmen routinely promised potential clients all sorts of things that our software was not capable of doing just to close the sale.
Lil_Red is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 12:55 AM   #4
Strider
Registered User
 
Strider's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
Posts: 387
Default

We ask some of our advertisers to prepay, simply because we have to pay our webmasters whether or not we get the advertisers payment on time. Their are a heck of a lot of deadbeat advertisers out their right now and it is really hurting the industry. In my opinion, that is the main reason companies are asking people to prepay for the leads, not because they want to take the money and run (although I am sure that happens too).
Strider is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 03:26 AM   #5
FC
Registered User
 
FC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 63
Default

If you ask me, the complete ad-business is a joke on internet.

There is way to much cheating out there, and my experiance as a publisher is that 90% of the ad-companies are a fraud.
FC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 10:39 AM   #6
FocaJohnL
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Newton, MA
Posts: 85
Default

Fraud is definitely a problem, both with advertisers as well as with publishers -- it's both sides of the fence. Where there's money, there's bound to be fraud. This is especially the case on the Internet, where advertising is still in its adolescence.

Unfortunately, there's not much to be done about it, other than reporting fraudulent behavior when it happens. Both advertisers and publishers are reluctant to use third party reporting, for a variety of reasons. Companies that maintain good business practices retain the good relationships -- and that's where the long term contracts come from. =)
FocaJohnL is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 12:49 PM   #7
dbcooper
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 95
Default

I sell a fair amount of sponsorships on my guide sites. In part to counter any concern over false promises or unrealistic expectations, I've just converted all accounts from annual prepay to monthly billing for 2002.

Over the past years, most of my clients were handshake deals anyway. Now, in my terms of service I flatly refuse contracts and state that if either of us becomes dissatisfied with the arrangement, the deal can be terminated with no questions asked. It works, and everyone -including the client- had better stay on his toes.
dbcooper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 01:04 PM   #8
darnell
Registered User
 
darnell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Suwanee, GA, USA
Posts: 704
Default

Show me an industry with no shady business people in it and I'll show you an industry with no business .
darnell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 02:29 PM   #9
tonyd203
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 103
Default Unfortunately there are some dishonest people out there

There doesn't always have to be shadiness going on. It is very unfortunate that there are some dishonest people in the world and what safer way to be a skunk is hiding behind a website. It's just not right. It gives those of us who are honest a bad rap

TD
tonyd203 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 02:31 PM   #10
OC
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2000
Posts: 697
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by darnell
Show me an industry with no shady business people in it and I'll show you an industry with no business .
I took your hypothetical challenge and thought about it for a while. I was just about to agree with you when I thought of grocery stores! When was the last time you were hoodwinked by a grocery store?


EDIT>
Then I remembered the two news reports a few years back about certain grocery chains repackaging steaks and ground beef that has surpassed their original expiration dates.

Last edited by OC; 12-05-2001 at 02:32 PM.
OC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 03:59 PM   #11
darnell
Registered User
 
darnell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Suwanee, GA, USA
Posts: 704
Default

I guess you've never worked at a grocery store OC? Glad you edited your post before my response .

I saw a report THIS MORNING about how grocery stores keep expired products on the shelves for sale. It was really a big story because people were getting items from the pharmacy area that were expired and causing medical issues.

Grocery stores have one of the lowest profit margins of most industries (so I've been told). They'll cut a corner in a second to save a buck.

Here is an article I found in a casual search about grocery stores.

There is not just corruption IN the store, but the products being sold are full of corruption. Sugar is one of the most overpriced products in a market. Nobody minds because it's so cheap, but we are all getting ripped off big time by sugar companies when it comes to the price of sugar. And the workers in sugar production are pretty much modern day slaves.

If you don't think corruption is part of an industry, just ask some people working in that industry. It may be covered well so you don't see it, but when there is money to be made corruption going to happen at some point if not always.
darnell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 04:03 PM   #12
qball0213
Registered User
 
qball0213's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 298
Default

Plus, you can be overcharged at the cash register, by items not scanning at the correct price, like paying normal price for something that's supposed to be on sale.
qball0213 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2001, 10:32 PM   #13
firstmark
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 836
Default

qball0213 plus in the grocery business we now have behavior based customer tracking. All of the store cards for discounts are done to enable tracking of related customer purchases and preferences. With a scan of a card a grocery chain knows what you bought at what time and how it compares to present and future purchases. If purchases slow down snail mail coupons are dispatched often. In grocery
stores in the pricing area things
probably equal out as undercharging and overcharging are done about equally. Most US states have regulators come in to check scales and make sure grade A eggs are sold as advertised and other such things.

As with any business laziness more than anything else leads to things not being as they are supposed to be.
Also in the tracking arena many grocery chains deploy coupons printed on register tape. This in essence is paid advertising enticing you to alter your buying patterns based on inside info of what you just in fact bought. In what other industry other than retail do we see ads from unrelated companies on receipts? Do we have advertising on the back of bank checks yet? And of course you have confusing coupons, no name brands with labels similar to the popular brands, and slotting fees which determine whose products appears where on the shelf. Also one has mail in coupons designed to on first glance appear to be coupons on the spot. Coupons are also designed on some occasions to blend in with packaging. This ensures that many items pass through with coupons never removed and never redeemed while only customers who truly noticed the coupon and probably would not have bought it without actually receive the coupons discount.

Grocery stores are more like mini supply warehouses where vendors, and merchandisers set up their own
displays and the store just processes payment. On the pricing thing you are more likely to encounter old price tags which differ from prices in the scanning/register system. This is the number one cause of price errors. Retail especially grocery has its faults but most don't understand how things are placed on the shelves or why and why they get certain coupons in the mail or ad circulars based on living in certain streets and not others. Its all related to analysis of customer data obtained through store cards and other such things.
firstmark is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
How little is too little CPM money? Larwee Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs 10 03-15-2005 09:47 AM
AdOrigin really pays $1 CPM? demae Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs 18 08-22-2001 03:49 PM
ValueClick offers CPM Campaigns! KP of Snooply Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs 25 06-19-2001 02:28 PM
CPM is Dead, Are you? deemis Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs 19 05-28-2001 08:43 AM
Analysis of effectiveness of lead programs suresk Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs 18 07-23-2000 04:07 AM

Please support our advertisers. They ensure our survival.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:18 AM.


GeekVillage.com is copyright © 1998-2015 Curiosity Cave - Science gifts for clever kids. All rights reserved.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.