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Old 06-03-2001, 06:06 PM   #61
Outlaw
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Hi, just a follow-up on the Media Metrix rankings... We could probably land a spot on the global top 50 (unique) I get 750k unique a month (at one point I got 1 million unique a month, and currently my site is listed in the top 1000 most hit sites on the web (as a network) by trafficranking.com. Anyhow I see us getting 5-10 million uniques a month, but impressions wise (HAHAHAHA!)

Check this link to see the top 10 impression wise http://www.jmm.com/press/adIndicators.html with Yahoo getting over EIGHT BILLION IMPRESSIONS! and with #10 getting over 500 million, we stand little chance impressions wise...

Anyhow... just felt those stats were somewhat cool to show ^_^

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Old 06-03-2001, 06:23 PM   #62
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Here's a kinda weird post. If this network gets off the ground I'd love to be a CPA sponsor on it. I know what you guys are thinking..."another CPA guy..." Well here's the deal I'd be able to offer. Instead of my normal payout of $5 per sale and $2 per month recurring, I'd be willing to pay $7 per sale and then $3 per month recurring. I'm sure this network could use some quick startup cash from me so if it could sell 1000 accounts for me in one month then you'd get a first month payment of $7000 and then $3000 every month after that (assuming 100% retention.) Just as a info update. I'm actually at 100% retention although my client list isn't huge, but with a service like mine it's unlikely to have much less than 80% retention.

I don't have huge traffic levels since I let my clients keep 100% of all ad space, but that's what I could offer. A guaranteed $3000 a month would help to cover your bandwidth every month.

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Old 06-03-2001, 06:49 PM   #63
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I agree with coolshop the network should have some kind of theme or be an about.com type resource.
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Old 06-03-2001, 07:02 PM   #64
Ralph Slate
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I hate to be negative here, but hasn't this already been done? As "Efront"?

This is 2-year ago thinking. Back then the word was "get big". So EFront got hundreds of millions of impressions together with the hopes of attracting advertisers.

Now the word is "be productive". 5 zillion untargetted impressions don't mean a thing. 1 million targetted impressions do.

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Old 06-03-2001, 07:34 PM   #65
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Okay, having had a few hours sleep, I'm ready to step back and take another look at how we've progressed thus far...

A few of the key points that have already been raised:
1. Trust and business accumen are required on behalf of the executives/leaders. (this is a given) As part of this, contracts and an appropriate business plan must be drafted and distributed to all members, since this is less an ad network, and more a communal partnership. Perhaps, even the network's financial reports should be distributed to members much as shareholders view quarterly and annual reports pertainig to the companies in which they have a stake.
2. An opt-in open marketplace is beneficial in revealing trends and highlighting the scope of the network. Sites should be seperated into topical and/or demographic channels, and ads should come both from the network's pool, and from individual sales.
3. A common brand should be developed (this is, of course, central to the whole project), and there may or may not be reason for eliminating the word "ad" from the brand.
4. Each topical channel should be linked in some fashion to a central news/content source that is seeded by members (think UGO.com, eFront.com - both in terms of pros and cons).

While still not perfect, I remain bullish about this idea for a few reasons. Condider the following:
A) To some extent, the entire web publishing community has been floundering around lately, with the demise of many content networks and ad networks devoted to small-medium sized sites. This has forced us to reconsider how best to leverage the web's strengths and weaknesses in order to provide value to our visitors, while creating revenue.
B) While some may (quite validly) suggest that this new concept sounds suspiciously similar to failed models that preceeded it, though there are a few key differences:
C) Within discussions lately that have highlighted the most successful internet businesses, eBay was an overwhelming favorite. The reason for this was that eBay achieved something that can only be done online, by taking full advantage of the web's infrastructure (both in terms of technology and usability). Much like the web itself, the members of this network will be geographically dispersed, effectively gaining greater reach than even the largest online ad nets, without the costs associated with travel, office overheads, fixed wages, and the like. What's more, it will be well positioned to solve media buyer's problems, by presenting a huge availability of quality inventory, with a salesforce that is inextricably linked to the development force (which allows us to move more rapidly to implement solutions - if, say, and advertiser wants to run 50,000 interstitials (CPM - with creatives to be designed by network), 100,000 skyscrapers (CPC - creatives supplied by advertiser), $5000 worth of text-based CPA leads, and press release distribution promoting a studio film prior to its release in a fortnight). Few networks could guarantee a roll-out such as this with the same expediency as a publisher-based network.
D) This network will be founded by members who all have some background in media sales, whether it be as little as developing a media kit and pushing their site to ad networks, or as much as regularly attending industry conferences, networking, cold calling big brands and creating technologies that solve advertiser's problems with online media. These members will be dispersed throughout the world, and will not expect, or receive, fixed wages. Their revenues will be based on what they bring to the network, in terms of inventory and person-hours (ie, developing flash ads, consulting for advertisers, creating and reselling reports based on the network's findings, etc).
E) Few (if any) of us could presently expect to receive a hearing from the big brands at present, since even those who serve 10,000,000 impressions/month are but a blip on the radar in this environment. The only way to attract advertiser attention presently is to offer flexibility, a large network, and the possibility for cross-media placement. As such, the network's brand may be leveraged to attract accounts that are beyond our reach as individuals, while providing us with the ability to align with a traditional-media partner looking to buy their way into the web. (Think the Primedia/About alliance, or the mammoth AOL Time Warner, which is clearly outperforming the dotcom pure-plays in terms of online ad revenues.)

Anyway, I think that all of the criticisms expressed thus far are valid, and I look forward to hearing more, in order to work out the kinks. I do, however, believe that a workable solution exists here.


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Old 06-03-2001, 07:45 PM   #66
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just gotta step in and give myself some credit...

I posted this a while back:

About is to X
as adathon is to luna

my idea was SIMPLY to have 1 webpage that listed all the sites involved in the network with a short description... if we all branded each other's pages with a small header that linked to this page.. that would mean we would do pretty good traffic sharing.

Just some ideas.


ohh yeah: I would be happy to make flash interactive banners for cj CPA programs and private advertisers... if you'all are interested. I can make some cool ones for like netsetter and other high paying cpa progs.

[This message has been edited by xuniverse (edited 06-03-2001).]
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Old 06-03-2001, 09:02 PM   #67
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alright..... I was bored so i just made this on a whimm.. I know its **** but ohh well:
http://www.somespot.com/mock.html
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Old 06-03-2001, 11:05 PM   #68
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also... how will this network decide who gets to be a member? Do you just have to be a geekvillage active member? Run a super quality site? I could probably serve about 300,000 ads a month or more... But thats not much compared to others who could serve 5,000,000... so does that mean I wont make the cut? You should think about how admintance will work.
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Old 06-03-2001, 11:06 PM   #69
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I like the idea of having a setting so it'll only show banners ABOVE a certain CPM. Doesn't Burst! have that option too? I know when things were going well that was a great tool for webmasters who wanted to only show the higher paying banners.

As far as admittance goes I'd say somewhere around 250k pageviews per month. That's small enough that you could have lots of member sites but large enough that you'd know the sites have some steady traffic.

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Keep 100% of the Banner Space! For only $10 per month
NetMongol Affiliate Program Paying $5 per sale and then $2 per month after that

[This message has been edited by Guava (edited 06-03-2001).]
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Old 06-03-2001, 11:09 PM   #70
KP of Snooply
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Webmaster5000 --
What you are saying is also true. And it's no problem that we get webmasters like you telling us this, because then it'll save us from mistakes. Right now, it seems that bandwidth is the only major concern to this project.

xuniverse --
I was thinking around 200k to 500k minimum and as high as 10 million monthly. Geek/Talk members get admitance first. I wouldn't think of letting any one else from outside this board or gethighforums. Everyone here is honest and we all know each other. Hopefully, this can be our home for chatting about the latest happenings in our network. Geek/Talk Network of Sites Powered by AdAthon.com http://geekvillage.com/ubb/wink.gif heh.

Guava --
I was thinking we could do that. But it would be even better if we can get the defaults going to DoubleClick. After all we are a network of sites, and not an AD network. We are a network of sites, selling ad space because we want our sites to stay alive. You can call it an ad network, but its really not. Its more like C|Net, ZDNet etc.

gethosted --
That'll be cool also http://geekvillage.com/ubb/smile.gif

The more traffic we get, the more noticable we will be. I had two people email me, which would be a combination of 8 million page views from the two sites. Things would go good. Again, if we could get into DoubleClick, and run their ads default. We'd be safe and we'd all be happy because we got into the network because of our high traffic volume http://geekvillage.com/ubb/smile.gif

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[This message has been edited by KP of Snooply (edited 06-03-2001).]
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Old 06-03-2001, 11:15 PM   #71
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I agree with Ralph. Big is not necessarily better. As a refugee from the sixties, I can tell you that anything that involves a group of people will be complicated. The bigger the group, the bigger the complication. Big networks fail just as often as little ones. I think an organization of webmasters dedicated to improving their lot is a good and noble idea. The problem with this idea is that it is based on greed. How can we all make more money? This is not a bad thing, but it is not noble. You will all most likely end up suing each other and making the lawyers rich. It happed in the sixties.
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Old 06-03-2001, 11:18 PM   #72
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KP,
I doubt DoubleClick would pick up the network until it has actually done some branding. You won't be able to start up with Doubleclick as your default. Maybe you could pick them up after 3-9 months once a brand has actually been built.

On another note, the idea of being able to select only CPM campaigns is good. What about the option of being able to disable certain campaigns like FastClick. That way if I want to just use the network for CPM I could disable all the CPC or CPA campaigns. One nice thing about this is that you could run CPA campaigns which in this tough time would be good to get started with. If webmasters have the option to select or deselect a campaign just as a CPA it'd be good because we all know there are some CPA's that pay nice net CPM's and if it doesn't work for your site then you can just stop showing that campaign. If this gets going anytime soon you could pick up alot of the higher quality low paying CPA's that CJ dropped.
------------------
Guava
NetMongol.com Free E-Mail @YourDomain.com
Keep 100% of the Banner Space! For only $10 per month
NetMongol Affiliate Program Paying $5 per sale and then $2 per month after that

[This message has been edited by Guava (edited 06-03-2001).]
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Old 06-03-2001, 11:23 PM   #73
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Part two. We are all upset because we can't make as much money on our sites as we made a year or two ago. This is because our income was being artificially inflated by the tech bubble in the stock market. Companies with no product, business plan, or profit were flush with IPO capital. We were feeding off it. It had to collapse and come back to earth. All bubbles burst eventually. Now, there are far fewer dollars and the companies that have survived are much more careful how they spend them. They want to know that their ad dollars are producing results...and so they should. Consolidation is taking place in the industry. It's a good thing. It means that the internet may survive and evolve.
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Old 06-03-2001, 11:23 PM   #74
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That looks great xuniverse. Simple, yet appropriate. http://geekvillage.com/ubb/smile.gif

I thought I'd also throw in an alternative idea for the revenue split aspect of the network. That is, the strength of the network brand is intended to attract contracts from a few of the larger online ad networks, which will be used as the foundation upon which we build. Now, some hesitation has been expressed in regards to the socialist method of attracting advertisers individually, before sharing the campaign with the network equally (or with a 10% bonus), due to the lack of incentives.

Now, it could be argued that without the backing of the network's name and inventory, no sale would have occurred in any place, suggesting that you're "better with something than nothing". Still, in order to see the best possible results, and considering that we are operating within a capitalistic structure, a more appropriate system may be this:

1. Publisher received low-CPM run-of-network and run-of-category ads from the network with no effort.
2. Publisher is granted a non-exclusive right to use the network's name in the marketing of their site/property to potential advertisers. In return for this right, the publisher agrees to grant the network 50% of the advertiser's campaign, while serving 50% themselves. The network will still collect the balance from the advertiser, and handle all administration, but the publisher will receive a large chunk of the earnings, with the rest distributed amongst othert sites within that topical/demographic category. Given that the alliance with this network will allow a publisher to sell up to twice as many ads as what he/she is able to serve alone, the revenues that are generated through such a transaction could be the same, if not higher, than if one was selling the ads independently.



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Old 06-03-2001, 11:43 PM   #75
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Important points/features to acknowledge IMO of course:

1)Open Statistics- So we can see how our sites are doing and what sites are getting what. I think openess can be a key to our success.

2)Defaults- We should be able to set default codes and choose when to use them. So if there is a campaign running at $.5 CPM and we only accept CPMs above .8 CPM we shouldn't have to server the $.5 CPMs.

3)Capable administrator- currently there are only a select few at geek/talk that I see as capable of doing this. I'm sorry to say that KP does not get my vote (for whatever it's worth) simply because his decisions so far seemed too rash. I also found too many errors in his logic to be comfortable.

4)Targeting ability- We should definately have separate categories so we can run targeted ads.
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