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Old 01-27-2001, 09:46 PM   #16
Kaiosama
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Thanks for the info singloon. Also ekke thanks for reminding me why I don't have a subscription based site. If he did that it would solve all his bandwidth problems though (huge loss of visitors).

I have way too much competition to make mines subscription based.

About search referral, it is making me over 1.2 CPM (this is estimation based on how many pageviews I get compared to the money I make). If he targets the text links well he should be able to pull though. Finding a more bandwidth friendly host should help too. There seems to be a huge difference in bandwidth pricing with some hosts.
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Old 01-27-2001, 11:22 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally posted by demae:
Don't know about Anime Inn, but the webmaster at Otaku World told me that they consume 600 GB of transfer per month. That's where their $1200 bill comes from.

He told me that they're trying one more thing, and if that doesn't work, they will switch to a subscription based model.
I've spoken with Anime Inn, and I need to check a few things out, but I believe it will be possible to save that site. As for Otaku World, I figured they ran up quite a bit of bandwidth based on the figure they quoted. 600GB is fairly close to what we do on 25 million page views (more than 80% of which are internally hosted), so I think they could cut it way down by reducing bandwidth.

BTW, if anyone comes across any more internet generation (games, movies, music, anime, etc... basically, just about anything covered on NetGenForums) sites that are in trouble and you want to see saved, let me know either by a post or e-mail, and I'll see what I can do.

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Old 01-27-2001, 11:48 PM   #18
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Don't get cogent access for another month+ at least :-(
They won't activate Los Angeles until Late Feb-Early March.


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Old 01-28-2001, 10:26 AM   #19
zapman
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It's good to see some in this forum exploring
alternative methods of payments for their web site content (subscriptions). Anyone who has seen any of my postings knows that I'm a big believer that Micropayments are the wave of the future.

Don't think big! Think small!

Instead of 1% of 100,000 paying $2.99/month, how about 10% paying $0.29/month or $0.07/week? Or maybe $.01 for a wallpaper, or $.05/hr to play a game?

The future is being forced upon us and will be here very shortly.
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Old 01-28-2001, 11:05 AM   #20
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You won't get 1% to pay for your site at $2.99.

You'll get .01% if your lucky.

And lowering it to $0.99 won't make much difference. Surfers don't pay for content except in very few circumstances. Many high profile sites, with established brand names, tried and gave up on charging even nominal subscription fees.

Micropayments may work better, but the infrastructure needs to be in place first.
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Old 01-28-2001, 11:06 AM   #21
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Micropayments may be the wave of the future... but it won't help most of the anime based websites in the present.

We would need a majority of the competition to die out first...

I guess the net might be coming back down to the real world. Before making webpages were inexpensive and financing high bandwidth sites were easy... Now we are feeling the pain of costs associated with paper.

Note that if I had as many pageviews as they do I would cut-off high bandwidth sections (like Anime-inn has) until I get the financial problems straightened out.

With 1.2 CPM and 25,000,000 pageviews I could make $30,000 with just text links. They might wanna think about that. But the task does not come without difficulty. You must target each page with the visitors interest.

The good thing is that this way visitors don't feel cheated with blind links or annoyed with pop-ups.

[This message has been edited by Kaiosama (edited 01-28-2001).]
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Old 01-28-2001, 11:49 AM   #22
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First, I'm not familiar with anime based websites so bare that in mind.

What if the 10 or 20 largest anime based websites ALL decided to charge for content? In a similar fashion as the "adult" world charges today for the "best" content via a membership fee.

Certainly this would require cooperation and the clear vision that all members of this select "group" would benifit. You need a sence of Community and strong leadership for this to work.

The net for the average surfer is that they must pay to get the very best as they have no other choice. You surrender part of the market to the smaller sites.

This is not a new idea I dreamed up. In many respects, you see a quasi "cartell" in the brick-and-mortar world where companies often ban together and "price fix"

Obviously, the FTC and other folks have a lot to say about this and I'm not advocating that anyone break the law on the Web.

My idea may also cause many people to complain because it's leading the Web away from great free content and into a far more commercial world.

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Old 01-28-2001, 02:06 PM   #23
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Otakuworld doesn't have 25000000 pageviews a month. 600G bandwith is due to their huge downloads.

Making cartel and charging on the visitors is a good idea but unrealizable to anime sites(and also to most general content sites like game review ones and others) for now. There are too many barrier to the realzation of the idea.
You know adult sites have extremely *attracting* contents and are targetted on adult audiences who have credit cards.

As Kaiosama said, Micropayment can be the wave of the future, but not of the present. Infrastructure is not established and we can't wait until it is built.

One successful example of South Korean company is like this;
Sayclub.com is a chatting site which has millions of members. As you know, no one click banners when they are chatting with others, and the company enfronted money problem soon. They have *strong* community, but when they charge on the members, they will fail despite of their strong community. They knew it well and started to use this method;

Setting 'strong community' forth as premise, instead of charging on current service they made new charged ones like items, clothes, and others(they have avatar chatting system). The point is that you give something special to the members in a prize for payment so that those who paid money can feel that they are special. This maybe seem tiny, but they earned much money using these kind of ways.

Building strong community->Intoxicating users with your service->Prize those who paid money. This way you won't lose any current members. No risk. If you fail, discard it and try other ways. If you succeed, you will get additional money. Anyway you won't lose current members whether you will succeed or fail. I'd like to name this kind of method as 'Microstrategy' http://geekvillage.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

This is my 2 cents http://geekvillage.com/ubb/smile.gif

BTW, below is off topic;
Snipped by Admin. Please start a new thread or contact the merchant directly about your own affiliate account. Your own issues with any merchant are not related to this thread and serve no usefull purpose for the Community inside this thread. Please consider this the first and last warning you will recieve. Thank you in advance for your anticaped cooperation-Steve_S/Admin

Thanks in advance.

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[This message has been edited by ekke (edited 01-28-2001).]

[This message has been edited by ekke (edited 01-28-2001).]



[This message has been edited by Steve_S (edited 01-28-2001).]
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Old 01-28-2001, 02:11 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally posted by ekke:
Making cartel and charging on the visitors is a good idea but unrealizable to anime sites(and also to most general content sites like game review ones and others) for now.
combatsim.com went to a subscription based model last month.

I'm not sure how well they're doing. I believe they're a two person (a guy and his wife) operation, and have something like 10 million page views a month, but their advertising could not sustain their bandwidth.
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Old 01-28-2001, 02:17 PM   #25
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When we were actively developing our forum, we came up with a few ideas that might encourage people to accept micropayments.

I think these would work well for a forum/community site, but not necessarily for anime, downloads or anything else.

Basically, you could offer the ability to become a "sponsor" member. People could become sponsors by donating $5 or $10, or perhaps buying a T-shirt.

Premier members could have special benefits, such as:

- Special areas to chat in.
- A special icon next to your name, so that everyone can see that you've supported the community.
- A whole bunch of smilies that they could use. http://geekvillage.com/ubb/smile.gif

The neat thing is, you don't have to close off any of your site, or send any visitors to competitors because they can't get to your content.
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Old 01-28-2001, 02:29 PM   #26
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If the downloads are contributing to the bandwidth bill... the sites should consider using anti-leech or doing other things to prevent leeching by other anime sites.

Unfortunately that is a huge problem in the anime community. If you create something great fans show their appreciation by copying from you... even worse leeching.

We have to deal with garbage like this on a daily basis. That is why I am striving to create a mostly information based site. That keeps the little ones away while attracting a much older (17-24) audience. It also keeps the bandwidth problems in check.

[This message has been edited by Kaiosama (edited 01-28-2001).]
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Old 01-28-2001, 04:55 PM   #27
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Ahh, here's the page that talks about combatsim's problems and why they went to a subscription model:
http://www.combatsim.com/csimfuture.htm
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Old 01-28-2001, 05:42 PM   #28
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It's beautifully written, and probably the model of how to approach it. I hope they do well. By the end of reading that, I was practically ready to search for my wallet just to help out! http://geekvillage.com/ubb/smile.gif

I'm sure we'll all learn a lot by watching how these early adopters fare with the paid subscription model.

I have a feeling that the readership's sense of connection with the site will be quite relevant to whether or not a site succeeds in moving to this model. A community-based site carries a lot of human interaction with it, and is much more likely to have readers who sympathize with the owner's situation, and are willing to help out.

A news site, for example, wouldn't enjoy the same visitor loyalty, and would have a harder transition to subscriptions, IMHO. All those big corporations who tried the subscription model and abandoned it may not be indicative of how a medium-sized fan-based site will fare.
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Old 01-28-2001, 06:13 PM   #29
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Why paid subscriptions? You can always make it free to the subscriber. I remember their were some newsletters and ezines that you can force users to sign-up to. You can make around 50 cents per subscription.

A site with two million pageviews (I can't imagine a site with 600 GB with any less) should get at the very least 10% of it's members subscribing for free. Thats about $100,000. If only 1 % of the sites visitors decide to sign-up (remember no cost to the user) then it makes $10,000.

This keeps the net FREE... You can always offer options to the user. They could get ezines or pay 2.99 (or whatever) monthly.

[This message has been edited by Kaiosama (edited 01-28-2001).]
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Old 01-28-2001, 06:22 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kaiosama:
I remember their were some newsletters and ezines that you can force users to sign-up to. You can make around 50 cents per subscription.
How do you "force" them to sign up?
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