Webmaster Forum Rules | Posting Guide | Contact Us | Testimonials | Contributing Geek Program | Advertise on Geek/Talk
Welcome to the GeekTalk Webmaster Discussion Forums from GeekVillage.com

Click Here To Register. It's Free!

Go Back   geek/talk: Signature-free discourse for serious web publishers > YOUR REVENUE: Making Money On The Internet > Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 12-06-2002, 03:34 PM   #31
darnell
Registered User
 
darnell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Suwanee, GA, USA
Posts: 704
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by njpete



The FTC seems to only be concerned with the consumer especially recently. But this is not in thier mandate they should also ensure that business runs smoothly. That's where the anti webmaster problem comes in, what group is helping internet commerce run smoothly.
Yea I know what the FTC is "suppose" to do, but we know a group only listens to the babies crying the loudest. So if you don't cry they are not going to hear you.

I'm sure the Feds will care more about our concerns the day after we allow them to tax web based purchases .

But this particular suit against Bonzi was not the FTC's doing. There have been private lawsuits that benefit consumers and others made by websites that benefit website owners. If you have an issue that you want the FTC to investigate for you then you need to let them know.
darnell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2002, 04:27 PM   #32
FreeArcade
I am a Contributing Geek. Are You?
 
FreeArcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Tecumseh, MI USA
Posts: 76
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by qball0213

Funny, when I visited your site, I got about 5 popups on two pages, and two download prompts, one for gator.
Yes, I am aware of that problem.
If you look at my code you will se that those are not coming from me. I only have code for a single popup.

Some unscrupulous advertiser is spawning those off of either one of my banners or the Advertising.com popup. I can't figure out who is doing it and All the advertisers deny it.

It has me ticked off.

__________________
Kevin Derby
www.FreeArcade.com

Last edited by FreeArcade; 12-06-2002 at 04:28 PM.
FreeArcade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2002, 04:44 PM   #33
FreeArcade
I am a Contributing Geek. Are You?
 
FreeArcade's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Tecumseh, MI USA
Posts: 76
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Robert from SI
>>>>>>>>
Any site that cannot survive without swindling their users >>>>>>>>

Swindling? Exactly how is the surfer being "swindled" by clicking on an ad?
Here is the definition of swindle from webster.com

"to obtain money or property by fraud or deceit"

People click on these ads because they are deceived in to thinking they are legitimate warning dialog boxes, and they are often full of misleading information.

The purpose of these deceptions is to make money.

Seems to qualify for the label to me.
__________________
Kevin Derby
www.FreeArcade.com
FreeArcade is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2002, 05:30 PM   #34
jkcity
Registered User
 
jkcity's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: England
Posts: 427
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by FreeArcade


Yes, I am aware of that problem.
If you look at my code you will se that those are not coming from me. I only have code for a single popup.

Some unscrupulous advertiser is spawning those off of either one of my banners or the Advertising.com popup. I can't figure out who is doing it and All the advertisers deny it.

It has me ticked off.

it can't of ticked you off that much cause you ain't pulled the code.
jkcity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2002, 07:52 PM   #35
qball0213
Registered User
 
qball0213's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 298
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by FreeArcade


Yes, I am aware of that problem.
If you look at my code you will se that those are not coming from me. I only have code for a single popup.

Some unscrupulous advertiser is spawning those off of either one of my banners or the Advertising.com popup. I can't figure out who is doing it and All the advertisers deny it.

It has me ticked off.

So your just going to keep running it until they quit or what?
Well it should be easy to spot, you should pull the advertising.com code on principal, they can shut the popups for you in your account. They did for me.
qball0213 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2002, 08:25 PM   #36
Czar

Webmaster
 
Join Date: Aug 1999
Location: Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia
Posts: 9,506
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by FreeArcade
Some unscrupulous advertiser is spawning those off of either one of my banners or the Advertising.com popup.
Just to reiterate the comments made by others on this issue, it is important that you pull the code of the responsible party as soon as possible.

While our membership may have mixed views about 'trick banners' and blind links, it remains united on the theftware issue. In fact, it is a rule of participation here that one share no association with the major theftware/scumware players. This includes supporting Gator's auto-download prompts (whose delivery method alone is highly questionable, never mind the net result).

Your first step, a qball suggested, should be to contact Advertising.com with a request to opt-out of their Gator campaigns. Since FastClick have never supported this firm, Ad.com are the likely culprit. I'm not sure who is behind the Xupiter download prompt, but it shouldn't take you more than a few minutes of trial-and-error to determine this.
__________________
Czar

Follow Geek/Talk's Twitter Feed and Facebook Page to stay up to date with new discussion threads and online ad industry highlights.

Important GeekVillage Links: Home | Rules | Posting Guide | Report Trouble | Feedback | Advertise on GV
Czar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2002, 08:34 PM   #37
Robert from SI
I am a Contributing Geek. Are You?
 
Robert from SI's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Marlton, NJ USA
Posts: 1,126
Default

>>>>>
"to obtain money or property by fraud or deceit"

The purpose of these deceptions is to make money.

Seems to qualify for the label to me.
>>>>>


I'm sorry, but I completely disagree with you.

No one is "making money or property" when an ad is clicked on unless that ad also has the ability to read the customers credit card information in their wallet.

It's an advertisement, not an automatic invoice.

Using your logic all infomercials are "swindles" because they appear to be a television program but are actually advertisements.

In a movie I saw last night the main character drank a Heineken beer. Was I being "swindled" because there was not a clear disclaimer stating the Heineken appeared due to a paid placement?

What about auto advertisement in a car magazine?

Radio commercials with music in them?

If you allow trial attorneys to dictate what ads you may and may not run on your site you're going to find yourself out of business.
__________________
It's all just ones and zeros.

Last edited by Robert from SI; 12-06-2002 at 08:35 PM.
Robert from SI is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2002, 09:37 PM   #38
Steve_S
I am a Contributing Geek. Are You?
 
Steve_S's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 1998
Location: Las Vegas, Nevada, USA
Posts: 5,224
Default

<Who want's a hundred pound can of decaf-coffee for the Holidays /joke>

My 2 cents and I'm not an attorney:

This "class" goes absolutely no where. Even if we assume 20K members of the class, you have no basis to determine "damage" and translate this to dollars and cents.

Respectfully, please don't tell me that a judge will say you wasted 2 minutes in a click and view and thats worth xxx dollars. Sorry...I don't think so. Like Robert and others said, their is no commerce involved. Translation: no money changed hands.

On the other hand, if you look at the numerous "Gator Suits" you have a reasonably sound basis to attach a monetary award to hijacking a visitor with a pop which does impose financial damage on the gagle of large media companies. Obviously their are others issues in this case but perhaps this will help clarify the difference.

AND, we have Miss Cleo and all that deseptive/trick stuff, which again involves an exchange of money.

Yes, I have been known to author what you may call "trick" stuff and I just call attention getting headlines which have a level of ambiguity and do work for a short time. Given this, the last thing in the world I want is the court and or government telling me what I can write for a headline.

Frankly, this "class" reminds me of the Male who is suing McDonalds because he became "obese" eating their food.



Just my 2 cents worth

Last edited by Steve_S; 12-06-2002 at 09:42 PM.
Steve_S is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-06-2002, 11:05 PM   #39
jnestor
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 473
Default

All of this begs the question of how can these advertisers make money off of these type ads? Yeah one or two of those ads got me to click the first time I saw it but my reaction was an immediate click on the back button. I'd never buy something from a site that tricked me into clicking onto it. I pretty much view it the same way as I view spam. Of course spam hasn't gone away either so I suspect some people are buying.
jnestor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2002, 05:14 AM   #40
Blubster
Registered User
 
Blubster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 183
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by jnestor
All of this begs the question of how can these advertisers make money off of these type ads?
Could be because users that are "dummies" enough to click on that banner, will be also reacting on banners/popups/textlinks/newsletter signups/downloads/.... on the landing page.
Blubster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2002, 12:07 PM   #41
darnell
Registered User
 
darnell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Suwanee, GA, USA
Posts: 704
Default Interesting....

You can't yell "FIRE" in a crowded room when there is no fire, but you can say "You've got 8 new messages" but not really have 8 new messages for the user. And you can present an icon universally known for closing a window and instead use it to lure people to your web page.

Some amazing logic being used I must say...

While I think some of my site's users are vultures and leeches looking for as much as they can for free, I can't ever say I'd think of them as "dummies".

These tricks may work for now, but as tricks have been busted in other advertising media they will eventually be hit on the web too. You're fooling yourself if you think otherwise.
darnell is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-07-2002, 02:18 PM   #42
qball0213
Registered User
 
qball0213's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 298
Default

Well you can hardly compare it to yelling fire in a movie theater, I would say it would compare more to walmart saying we got dvd players for 50 bucks, and really only having 10 or so, to draw the crowds in. It's a numbers game, like Nintendo and Amazon, the more numbers you throw at it, the more that stick.
I'd hardly call it illegal, these companies are just taking advantage of webmasters looking for easy cpm money and users that don't know any better.
It will go away eventually, when it's no longer worth it to the companies that run them.
qball0213 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2002, 06:12 PM   #43
AdGoblin
Registered User
 
AdGoblin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 14
Default

A buddy of mine actually knows about the attorney heading up this class-action suit. I'm told he is the same goof-ball that sued his previous employer for cracking his tooth on some candy that the company gave out.

I'm going to have to agree with Steve and think this isn't going to go too far.

I also looked at some of the suspect ads, and one of them used the word 'may' which is used in so many ads. "Studies have shown that eating these protien bars may increase your testosterone output by up up to 46.2%....blah blah" As long as you don't straight up claim something that isn't true, you should be OK anyway. There is a big difference between between "Your Internet connection is not optimized" on a banner, vs. "Your Internet connection may not be optimized."

AG
AdGoblin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2002, 07:13 PM   #44
jkcity
Registered User
 
jkcity's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: England
Posts: 427
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by AdGoblin
I also looked at some of the suspect ads, and one of them used the word 'may' which is used in so many ads. "Studies have shown that eating these protien bars may increase your testosterone output by up up to 46.2%....blah blah" As long as you don't straight up claim something that isn't true, you should be OK anyway. There is a big difference between between "Your Internet connection is not optimized" on a banner, vs. "Your Internet connection may not be optimized."
My understanding was it is not the wording of the banners its the fact they look like part of the operating system, causeing people to click on them.
jkcity is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-08-2002, 08:30 PM   #45
jnestor
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 473
Default Re: Interesting....

Quote:
You can't yell "FIRE" in a crowded room when there is no fire, but you can say "You've got 8 new messages" but not really have 8 new messages for the user.
Let's see someone yelling "fire" in a crowded theater causes people to panic and run for the exits where people are trampled leading to serious injury and death.

A banner that says "you have 8 new messages" hasn't caused any injury or death as far as I know.
jnestor is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
text ads competitive with adsense? dognose Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs 3 04-04-2006 11:59 PM
PayPal Litigation Settlement... Eric_eLyrics Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs 10 08-01-2004 08:30 PM
eFront? Class Action lawsuit?!?! Outlaw Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs 5 07-05-2001 11:40 PM
Alexa Class Action Lawsuit Rhea Web Design and Webmaster Issues 0 05-14-2001 05:43 PM
Highly Targetted Ads - how to sell em WildComputer Making Money with CPC and/or CPM Programs 2 08-18-1999 08:27 PM

Please support our advertisers. They ensure our survival.

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:39 AM.


GeekVillage.com is copyright © 1998-2015 Curiosity Cave - Science gifts for clever kids. All rights reserved.
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.